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Author Topic: List of viable bosses to do a Perfect/Awesome.  (Read 7083 times)

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Offline Lukmendes

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List of viable bosses to do a Perfect/Awesome.
« on: March 11, 2015, 01:41:19 AM »
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As we all know, Somacula will be added as a "secret" final boss on the game for Nightmare mode only, and one of the conditions to fight him is to do an unknown ammount of Perfect/Awesome (Which means, beat the boss without taking damage), and since not all bosses are possible to defeat without taking hits (Without having to rely heavily on luck that is), I'm just separating here the ones who are.

Note: The list is not final, it's based only on my testings against the bosses.

Now for the list:

Universal:

Abaddon
(click to show/hide)

Agni
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Akmodan
(click to show/hide)

Astarte
(click to show/hide)

Balore
(click to show/hide)

Blackmore
(click to show/hide)

Carmilla
(click to show/hide)

Dario
(click to show/hide)

Gergoth
(click to show/hide)

Giant Bat
(click to show/hide)

Great Armor
(click to show/hide)

Great Minotaur
(click to show/hide)

Remilia
(click to show/hide)

Rusalka
(click to show/hide)

Skull Knight
(click to show/hide)

Stella
(click to show/hide)

Wyvern
(click to show/hide)

Zephyr
(click to show/hide)

Character specific

Cerberus
(click to show/hide)

Dogether
(click to show/hide)

Dracula
(click to show/hide)

Great Werewolf
(click to show/hide)

Medusa
(click to show/hide)
« Last Edit: January 07, 2017, 03:29:05 PM by Lukmendes »

Offline Anonymous

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Re: List of viable bosses to do a Perfect/Awesome.
« Reply #1 on: March 11, 2015, 01:36:51 PM »
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I honestly think that it is also possible to get Perfect/Awesome when fighting Lesser Demon. The chances are higher if you use a character whose attacks don't disappear after hitting only one or few targets. It's also easy for whip users because spinning the whip destroys the ghosts and the fireballs. Just make sure you don't get cornered....(I still can't defeat him as Alucard in Nightmare mode....damnit).


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Offline Lukmendes

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Re: List of viable bosses to do a Perfect/Awesome.
« Reply #2 on: March 11, 2015, 02:13:31 PM »
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I'm not sure about Lesser Demon, what generaly may make it not really viable for a character to do Perfect/Awesome against him is the character lacking a safe and fast way to destroy the flying skulls, similar to Dogether and the rocks attack, characters who can destroy projectiles easily can deal with Lesser Demon just fine, but I'm not sure about characters like Yoko who lack fast and reliable way to destroy the flying skulls before they leave Lesser Demon's body.

Alucard has three ways to deal with the flying skulls, use Dark Inferno and make the lava orbs go up, may not work often because some skulls can fly too high and escape from the lava orbs, use f,f+A or use a throwing axe, I personaly preffer to use the last one.

Edit: Forget what I said about Yoko, I forgot she can use Holy Lighting sub weapon to destroy the flying skulls, also Thor's below, but I don't like it's slower recovery... I'll test out with other characters later to see if they have reliable ways to destroy the flying skulls.

Edit 2: Added a big section for Lesser Demon.
« Last Edit: March 14, 2015, 04:46:15 AM by Lukmendes »

Offline Lukmendes

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Re: List of viable bosses to do a Perfect/Awesome.
« Reply #3 on: May 03, 2015, 06:09:13 AM »
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Added sections for Wyvern and Astarte.

Also I'm not sure if Lesser Demon should stay on this list, it can summon more flying skulls in case you destroy 4 of them too early, and with some characters, there isn't an always a reliable way to destroy all flying skulls, some characters also can't destroy flying skulls without risks in case they fail in doing so when Lesser Demon is summoning them...

Offline Anonymous

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Re: List of viable bosses to do a Perfect/Awesome.
« Reply #4 on: May 03, 2015, 09:12:52 AM »
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Lesser Demon is actually still possible but the arsenal of characters that can do so is also very limited. You require more luck than other bosses in my opinion. It's easier for characters that have dashes or teleports (Richter, Julius), or those that have wide area attacks (Soma, Maxim (not quite sure if he can), Charlotte) or whip users at least for the skulls and fireballs, but for characters that don't have much mobility and have difficulties destroying many projectiles, yeah.....

Edit: Stella is possible, but only for characters that have abilities which can dish out good damage from a distance. You also have to at least know the boundaries of your character's hitbox (hurricane can hit you if you're crouching sometimes). She's also easy against characters that can hit airborne enemies quite well, like belmonts (axe), Soma (Erinys, if you can hit it, the sniper), Charlotte (skeleton, tempest if you can), etc. For every character though, just backdash or juke the crescent moons.

Blackmore seems easy, but he's only predictable. In my opinion, it depends on how quickly you can finish him. For Juste and Hugh, who can finish off "thick" enemies quickly, it shouldn't be much of a problem (Juste requires a lot of luck, though, damn his hcf+a has a really long pause time). Also if you can dash through him while he's slashing in time, you can get free hits, just backdash before he turns around, otherwise the almighty contact damage hits you lol.
« Last Edit: May 03, 2015, 09:23:17 AM by Anonymous »


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Offline Lukmendes

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Re: List of viable bosses to do a Perfect/Awesome.
« Reply #5 on: May 03, 2015, 02:04:08 PM »
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The problem is that some characters may lack the tools to destroy the flying skulls consistently, axe doesn't always work for characters who don't have anything better, sure someone like Charlotte or Soma just destroy Lesser Demon on the matchup, but not everyone is like them.

Stella, I kinda have my doubts because of the way she uses her Crescent Moons, usualy the best way to avoid them is dashing under her, but sometimes she can fly pretty low, so you'll be at the corner jumping from them, there's also her qcf attack, she may dash in too close and make a very hard to escape contact damage, but I haven't fought her enough to be sure if everything is avoidable.

Blackmore, if the character has a throwing axe I just stay on the corner and throw it until Blackmore dies, it hits multiple times, so it really hurts him, trying to go behind him seems like a waste of time honestly, you could be using that MP to just throw more axes lol, I'll see more characters to be sure though, but I'm 99% sure it's possible to beat him without taking hits with all characters since you can just stay on the corner to avoid his attacks (Backdash when he uses that orb which falls on you, it'll even avoid the pillar it makes, and jump to avoid everything else, walking forward to avoid the falling orb also works, but you kinda risk receiving contact damage if he decides to use the beam attack).

Edit: Added Blackmore to the list, I don't know why I ever doubted it was possible to defeat him withou taking hits lol.
« Last Edit: May 03, 2015, 03:05:32 PM by Lukmendes »

Offline Anonymous

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Re: List of viable bosses to do a Perfect/Awesome.
« Reply #6 on: May 05, 2015, 04:35:59 PM »
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Well, all I can say is that technically you can get perfect/awesome on every boss with every character. The only thing is on some it's very easy and requires pure skill and experience, on some it's very difficult that you need to have made countless attempts, and in the remaining it's that difficult you require pure luck that the random number generator is in your favor.

Well, except Olrox. Too many familiars in the room to be able to get perfect/awesome.


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Offline Lukmendes

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Re: List of viable bosses to do a Perfect/Awesome.
« Reply #7 on: May 05, 2015, 05:15:57 PM »
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Well, yeah, most bosses can be defeated without taking hits, but having to rely on "please don't use this" to do so is why I don't put them on the list, I mean, there was one time I defeated Brauner without taking hits with Charlotte, and one time I almost defeated Death without taking hits with Julius, but it was a combination of characters tools (Charlotte rapes Brauner, Julius has Belmont stuff and his dodges help him to avoid some of Death's bullshit), but that's not something that will happen reliably.

Let's not forget some characters just don't have the tools to deal with situations without avoiding hits, Hammer vs Great Werewolf is an example of this, Hammer can't destroy the wolves without taking hits, so at the very moment Great Werewolf summons them, his chances of not taking hits are over, meanwhile, with Marias, if Great Werewolf summons the wolves, Marias just backdash and keep mashing A to avoid Great Werewolf, while damaging him, while destroying the wolves (easier said than done though), or use Azure Dragons to do it more safely, or just activate the invincible mode if the fight is near the end/they're cornered (Bonus: RoB Maria has her f,f+A/C which is great at damaging Great Werewolf and destroying the wolves), so Marias are much better at dealing with Great Werewolf than Hammer and have much better chances at doing no damage than him.
« Last Edit: May 05, 2015, 05:33:46 PM by Lukmendes »

Offline Lukmendes

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Re: List of viable bosses to do a Perfect/Awesome.
« Reply #8 on: June 03, 2015, 05:53:49 PM »
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Updated Carmilla's and Gergoth's sections, it was really shitty before, now there's an actual explanation on how to avoid their attacks and when to attack them, and I removed Lesser Demon's section because characters generaly can't deal with flying skulls very well (I have it saved here just in case though).

Post Merge: June 04, 2015, 03:42:01 PM
Updated Abaddon, Agni, Blackmore, Dario and Great Minotaur and Great Armor, now it has better explainations about their attacks (Not so much for Great Armor and Great Minotaur since they're so simple though) and when to attack.
« Last Edit: June 04, 2015, 03:43:17 PM by Lukmendes »

Offline Lukmendes

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Re: List of viable bosses to do a Perfect/Awesome.
« Reply #9 on: June 12, 2015, 08:33:49 PM »
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With the 0.6.12 patch, Abaddon and Great Armor received small changes on their AI which change the matchup a bit, but it's still possible to beat them without taking hits, Abaddon is important with all characters (Basicaly, he'll turn around to face the character when using locusts, and you need to be at the corner just so he doesn't jump at the character) and Great Armor now blocks all item crashes which don't do unique damage, those informations are added on the first post.

Offline Anonymous

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Re: List of viable bosses to do a Perfect/Awesome.
« Reply #10 on: June 15, 2015, 04:27:25 PM »
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Just saying, you forgot to mention that Maxim's item crash isn't blocked by Great Armor.

Decided to take a run through the tier 1 bosses. 4 aren't listed and in my opinion:

Lesser Demon: I have to agree with you on this one. Easiest for Belmonts because of whip spin, but hitting all skulls with just axes takes some luck, as some fly upwards, away from the axes. It's also easy for characters like Soma because, well, Erinys. So far I got perfect with Julius and Soma.

Dogether: Just like LD, whip spin and axes (since 6.12) for destroying the rocks, but for some non-whip users, dealing with the rocks can be difficult.

Giant Bat: The situation is like Stella and Zephyr. Unless he doesn't use this certain attack too often (I was shocked that he can hit the player with the dash even while crouching, at least in my case), it's possible.

Cerberus: Completely out of the question.

Also in my opinion, I doubt the amount of perfect/awesome we need will be more than 10 or so. The thing is, while we have 10(+2 if you count Stella and Zephyr btw) bosses listed here (with strategies, nice work), 4 (?) are in story tiers and the other 6 are random. So unless patch99_boss.dog is set, getting exactly 10 or more would depend on luck that you get those bosses listed here.


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Offline Lukmendes

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Re: List of viable bosses to do a Perfect/Awesome.
« Reply #11 on: June 15, 2015, 05:31:19 PM »
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Just saying, you forgot to mention that Maxim's item crash isn't blocked by Great Armor.

I actualy didn't even know about that, I don't play as Maxim so much, thanks.

Quote
Dogether: Just like LD, whip spin and axes (since 6.12) for destroying the rocks, but for some non-whip users, dealing with the rocks can be difficult.

I don't find rocks to be that much of a threat, if a character lacks whip spin or similar I tend to walk away while the rocks try to hit the character then double jump on the corner, I think it's possible to avoid everything by just staying at the corner and jumping, the way to do so would be by doing a well timed super jump to make the character hit his/her head at the celing to make the character fall faster, while avoiding some of the rocks, but anyway, the biggest problem is how low he can fly and sometimes he can get you stuck on a corner while flying low, so if he uses the fire attack, you'll only escape because you made a right guess, not because you reacted apropriately, this kind of randomness + the stage you fight him is why I don't think it's possible for him to be included on this list, but then again if he couldn't fly low he'd be another Great Minotaur of how easy it'd be to beat him.

Quote
Giant Bat: The situation is like Stella and Zephyr. Unless he doesn't use this certain attack too often (I was shocked that he can hit the player with the dash even while crouching, at least in my case), it's possible.

It's probably possible by characters who have slides, since it avoids the dash in attack, I myself have trouble to avoid that fireballs attack which track a bit, specialy if he gets me stuck in a corner where I have to worry about that attack and the dash in one.

Quote
Also in my opinion, I doubt the amount of perfect/awesome we need will be more than 10 or so. The thing is, while we have 10(+2 if you count Stella and Zephyr btw) bosses listed here (with strategies, nice work), 4 (?) are in story tiers and the other 6 are random. So unless patch99_boss.dog is set, getting exactly 10 or more would depend on luck that you get those bosses listed here.

Well, I have no idea when Somacula is gonna be added, if it's in 1.0 then yeah, I think patch99 will be needed to avoid having to count on luck to face a specific boss to beat without taking hits, but if it's after 1.1 is released then I don't think there'll be a problem, 1.0 MUGEN has 10 tiers to put those bosses, and 4 bosses are mandatory to fight on non story tiers, but with 1.1 there's 30 tiers, so it's much better to organize those things and Serio could just put some of the "no damage" bosses together.

Anyway, Zephyr and Stella might not be possible, Stella lately is a bit more random and sometimes she gets too close and avoiding her attacks is complicated, Zephyr, I think he uses the bitchslap less often if you're jumping, but the real problem is how he can teleport sometimes, seems like he only uses it when he's dying, but maybe he does so only after taking a lot of damage, plus sometimes he can randomly jump on a wall and makes some attacks hader to avoid, I'll do proper testings later.

Lately I'm suspecting Akmodan is possible to beat without taking hits, I'll have to find proper ways to avoid his projectile attack though (Characters like Soma can just destroy it, but this list is "universal" after all), and the bricks which surround the character, I'll add Rusalka to this list later, she was always possible to do no damage against, I didn't realize it because I wasn't fighting her properly, she was just a bit harder than the other bosses because you'd have to space out properly against her and just not attack in some situations, also be careful with the rocks, but now she's much easier since she abuses that hose attack, which is basicaly "Backdash to get close to attack the boss: The move".
« Last Edit: June 15, 2015, 06:57:48 PM by Lukmendes »

Offline s̻͔̦͔e̫̣̹͕r̤̗̤̥͔i͎̪̳̺̜o̰̜͓̫̺͖

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Re: List of viable bosses to do a Perfect/Awesome.
« Reply #12 on: June 15, 2015, 06:23:45 PM »
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Quote
Just saying, you forgot to mention that Maxim's item crash isn't blocked by Great Armor.
it will now. unique damage not being blocked by him was a bug.

he did that by setting his physical and magical defense multiplier to 0 so every attack was multiplied by 0 and negated, but unique bypassed that and force set it to 1, ignoring everyone's defenses.
« Last Edit: June 15, 2015, 06:53:01 PM by serio »
Dracula was here

Offline Lukmendes

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Re: List of viable bosses to do a Perfect/Awesome.
« Reply #13 on: June 16, 2015, 12:23:13 AM »
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Updated Dario's, Gergoth's and Great Armor's sections a bit to detail more, and since the sections where getting pretty big, I put them under spoiler to not cover so much space, also added sections for Rusalka and Zephyr.

Post Merge: June 17, 2015, 09:01:12 PM
Added a section for Giant Bat.

By the way Serio, I would advice for Giant Bat's damage to be beefed up a bit, even when you couldn't crouch under the dash in attack, you didn't have to respect him because his damage output is pretty low, so he was weak even by first tier standards, now that you can crouch under his dash in attack, you can respect him even less, even if you don't want/don't know how to beat him without taking hits.

Edit: Update Astarte's section, found a much more consistent strategy on how to avoid her attacks at the beginning of the fight.
« Last Edit: June 18, 2015, 02:16:43 AM by Lukmendes »

Offline Lukmendes

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Re: List of viable bosses to do a Perfect/Awesome.
« Reply #14 on: June 23, 2015, 12:23:08 AM »
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Updated Carmilla's and Zephyr's sections, with Zephyr I added a detail I forgot to mention (Damaging him too much when he's dying = random teleport), with Carmilla I added safer strategies to avoid her, as well as the best way to generaly jump from one platform to the other (Jump, super jump, double jump).