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Author Topic: List of viable bosses to do a Perfect/Awesome.  (Read 7067 times)

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Offline Anonymous

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Re: List of viable bosses to do a Perfect/Awesome.
« Reply #15 on: June 28, 2015, 04:13:31 PM »
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Also for Blackmore, his attacks change in a similar way to Dario's. Usually he attacks with his hands 3 times, but after he has lower than half his health, he attacks 5 instead. Same goes for the crouching and then using the beam.


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Offline Lukmendes

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Re: List of viable bosses to do a Perfect/Awesome.
« Reply #16 on: June 29, 2015, 03:05:39 PM »
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Also for Blackmore, his attacks change in a similar way to Dario's. Usually he attacks with his hands 3 times, but after he has lower than half his health, he attacks 5 instead. Same goes for the crouching and then using the beam.

Ah yes, I forgot to update that about the hands attack, didn't know about the attacking then crouching then use the beam while crouching though, thought he'd randomly get up for a brief moment, thanks.

Post Merge: July 02, 2015, 12:48:59 AM
Made small updates on the list, removed the part where I said you can just use unique damage item crashes against Great Armor, not the case anymore (Only Julius can do it now though), replaced it with another one on how to hit him with other item crashes though (Had forgotten about that strat lol), also added a small detail about a move I forgot to mention, added more details to the Rusalka matchup, added a character specific matchup detail vs Dario (Important if you use Master Skeleton), and removed the "Frog might not/can't defeat this boss without taking hits" from Carmilla's and Zephyr's sections since he now has a complete moveset, projectiles included.

Post Merge: July 02, 2015, 09:18:36 PM
Updated Rusalka's section, listed more opportunities you have to attack her.
« Last Edit: July 02, 2015, 09:18:36 PM by Lukmendes »

Offline Medlin

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Re: List of viable bosses to do a Perfect/Awesome.
« Reply #17 on: July 08, 2015, 11:42:18 AM »
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I actually believe it's possible to perfect LD with every character but you need the great timing attacking him when he summon. Trying that currently, require too much practice somehow.

Offline Lukmendes

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Re: List of viable bosses to do a Perfect/Awesome.
« Reply #18 on: July 08, 2015, 02:17:15 PM »
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I actually believe it's possible to perfect LD with every character but you need the great timing attacking him when he summon. Trying that currently, require too much practice somehow.

It's not just timing, it's luck as well in some cases, the flying skulls may come out at random positions, which can ruin the way some characters can destroy them if they come out too low or too high.

Then there's also the problem of some characters lacking slides, which is bad when Lesser Demon corners them, slide is the best way to avoid him when he jumps at the character.

I'm not saying it's impossible to defeat him without taking hits, it's just that Lesser Demon isn't like the other listed bosses where you have universal ways to avoid their attacks, he's a more character specific kind of boss when it comes to doing a perfect, the ones I can think of right now who can do so are whip users (Includes Reimu), Charlotte, Soma, Shanoa, and others like Marias and Sakuya, but other characters just lack a consistent way to destroy the flying skulls or to avoid his corner pressure, and to be able to do both is what's important to do a perfect.

Of course, that's as far as I've played, maybe I'm missing something on the matchup to avoid his attacks better in an universal way.

Post Merge: July 12, 2015, 08:33:47 PM
I decided to start to put a character specific list here, this one obviously isn't universal, as long as one character can beat a boss viably without taking hits, it can be added there.

Only added Balore for now, feeling lazy to write about other bosses at the moment.

What's the character limit per post? That list can get pretty big, might not be enough for first post.
« Last Edit: July 12, 2015, 08:34:08 PM by Lukmendes »

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Re: List of viable bosses to do a Perfect/Awesome.
« Reply #19 on: July 13, 2015, 03:02:20 AM »
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100k characters.
Dracula was here

Offline Lukmendes

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Re: List of viable bosses to do a Perfect/Awesome.
« Reply #20 on: July 13, 2015, 03:45:02 AM »
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Damn, that's a lot lol.

I've checked here, and the first post has "only" a bit less than 30k, guess I really don't have to worry about lack of characters.

Post Merge: July 14, 2015, 04:45:47 AM
Added Lesser Demon to the character specific list, I feel like it's incomplete, possibly more characters can be added, any ideas on who else could be added, let me know.
« Last Edit: July 14, 2015, 04:45:47 AM by Lukmendes »

Offline Lukmendes

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Re: List of viable bosses to do a Perfect/Awesome.
« Reply #21 on: July 21, 2015, 08:27:04 PM »
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Made small updates on Balore's section when mentioning Alucard because of the changes he received, also a small update on Rusalka option (Just mentioning the turn around while crouching and attacking which makes a f,f attack happen).

I'm planning to add Dracula next, only when my lazyness to fight him to do more testings is gone though, lol.

Post Merge: July 22, 2015, 03:37:45 AM
Added Dracula to the character specific list, for now only Jonathan, Albus and Alucard are there, because they're the only ones I've confirmed they can beat Dracula without taking hits, Julius, Stella, Persephone, Montano, Sakuya, Reimu, SotN Maria Richters/Hanz and Juste, among possible others are candidates to entering that list too, but I need to be sure all of them can avoid Dracula's second form meteor attack and the projectiles properly.
« Last Edit: July 22, 2015, 03:37:45 AM by Lukmendes »

Offline Lukmendes

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Re: List of viable bosses to do a Perfect/Awesome.
« Reply #22 on: August 02, 2015, 07:01:13 PM »
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Added Skull Knight to the list, and surprisingly, he's on the universal list, I used to think that only flight characters and the ones who have low hurtbox while crouching would be able to beat him without taking hits, but I found some strategies everyone can use.

I think that Stella will be able to do more Perfect/Awesome against bosses than anyone else on the game, she's the jack of all trades of the game, and since she has basicaly every important tool the game has to offer (While also not having the best version of those tools), she may be in every character-specific list.

Offline Lukmendes

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Re: List of viable bosses to do a Perfect/Awesome.
« Reply #23 on: August 25, 2015, 07:59:45 PM »
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Made small changes on the list, added a character specific detail for Julius on Dario's, Astarte's and Zephyr's sections since lack of daggers changes those matchups, removed the strat for Axe Armor on the Great Armor match up since he can use the bombs instead of Shockwave now, removed the part of the Skull Knight section where it mentioned you can jump over his beam (Not possible anymore), and added the detail of a glitch with Rusalka when she uses the water hose attack.

Offline Anonymous

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Re: List of viable bosses to do a Perfect/Awesome.
« Reply #24 on: August 31, 2015, 01:24:59 PM »
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Quote
Added Dracula to the character specific list, for now only Jonathan, Albus and Alucard are there, because they're the only ones I've confirmed they can beat Dracula without taking hits, Julius, Stella, Persephone, Montano, Sakuya, Reimu, SotN Maria Richters/Hanz and Juste, among possible others are candidates to entering that list too, but I need to be sure all of them can avoid Dracula's second form meteor attack and the projectiles properly.

I'd say Julius can do it easier against the meteors, but he requires more timing because in my opinion his up, qcf+A/C has less I-Frames than the characters you already mentioned. Sakuya seems simple too because she can back- and do a "frontdash" (you can use her up, qcf+A/C but I wouldn't really rely on that short time frame.), same goes for Reimu. Come to think of it, they can also float so it's kind of cheap that they can continue hitting Dracula during the fire wave (very MP heavy though so I don't use it too much, that depends on what items the player bought.) For Persephone it's quite risky, her divekick has quite unpredictable range (at least for me), though it gives nice invincibility. For the rest, I'm still considering whether they can (I'm really thinking that Sotn Maria can manage). Also, why is Montano in the list?

Can you give me tips when fighting Cerberus? I keep dying when fighting him if I'm not using any Belmonts or Soma. (Yes I'm embarassed to say I die even when using Alucard) (Most difficulties when using Werewolf and Persephone for some reason.)


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Offline Lukmendes

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Re: List of viable bosses to do a Perfect/Awesome.
« Reply #25 on: August 31, 2015, 02:23:23 PM »
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I'd say Julius can do it easier against the meteors, but he requires more timing because in my opinion his up, qcf+A/C has less I-Frames than the characters you already mentioned.

In case his up, qcf +A or C ends up being unreliable (Which I honestly doubt since he can use it once, then use it again right away, though it does have some frames he'll be vulnerable), he can just double jump and super jump then use his Y dodge to go down, wastes MP, but unlike Albus, he doesn't need much MP to damage Dracula.

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Sakuya seems simple too because she can back- and do a "frontdash" (you can use her up, qcf+A/C but I wouldn't really rely on that short time frame.)

Sakuya can avoid the meteors on the same basic way as Alucard, he can avoid it with his f,f+C, then go down, then use the divekick to avoid getting hit, Sakuya can do the same thing with her up,qcf+C.

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Come to think of it, they can also float so it's kind of cheap that they can continue hitting Dracula during the fire wave (very MP heavy though so I don't use it too much, that depends on what items the player bought.)

Flight characters always had this advantage against him lol, Shanoa is the most damaging one, flight, f,f+A or C, then Glyph spear, repeat, though she isn't on this patch, since Sakuya's daggers are doing ridiculously high ammount of damage.

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For Persephone it's quite risky, her divekick has quite unpredictable range (at least for me), though it gives nice invincibility.

You need to use her f,f+A or C depending on where Dracula is, if he's at the other side of the screen, at the corner, then you need to backdash cancel until you reach the corner, and use f,f+A or C on the ground, if you use it in the air, she'll fall and get hit by Dracula, if he's at the middle of the stage, then double jump, super jump and use the f,f+A or C in the air, that way she'll go above him and avoid the contact damage, SotN Maria can do the same thing in case using air dashes ends up not being reliable.

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Also, why is Montano in the list?

He can use his air, qcf+A or C to avoid the meteors, he's invincible when the move is activated, so he'll avoid the meteors just fine, basicaly the same thing Albus can do with his qcf+A or C, he can also destroy the dogs with his beam very reliably, and I don't see him having trouble to destroy the bats on the last part of the fight thanks to his regular sword's boosted damage and his ice cross.

A while ago I noticed another problem showed up to do no damage against Dracula, which is the last part of the fight, the first wave of bats is kinda complicated to destroy with some characters, namely Sakuya and Persephone, Sakuya probably will need to use the stop watch item crash then keep abusing the golden daggers, no problem to do it now because of the retarded damage triple/quadruple shot golden daggers do, but this will gone later, Persephone will have a harder time since her only options are her A normal and her shuriken, it's probably possible, but I'm not completely sure.

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Can you give me tips when fighting Cerberus? I keep dying when fighting him if I'm not using any Belmonts or Soma. (Yes I'm embarassed to say I die even when using Alucard) (Most difficulties when using Werewolf and Persephone for some reason.)

Alucard actualy has a better matchup against Cerberus than the usual Belmont since he has f,f+C, can fly, and his doggy dash makes him duck under the fireballs while it charges lol.

Against Cerberus, you shouldn't be too close to him, since it makes it harder to avoid his fireballs and dash bite, when he corners you, a good thing to do is jump once, that's to bait hit into using his anti air firebreath attack, if he uses it, you'll probably land before it hits you, that will leave Cerberus open to being attacked, so you can use a quick attack like holy water. The fireballs, you need to duck when he shoots them, not before, when you duck, his only attack options are firebreath and dash bite, so duck carefuly, with this, characters can use a crouching attack against him, really good in case you can use  sub weapons while crouching, if your character has a move which goes from the air to the ground, then jump, and if he starts the fireball, super jump forward then use a regular jump to safely land on the platform, then throw it, and once he's finished, you can try to stay on the platform for a bit to try to bait him into using his anti air stuff, super jump into the corner, and if he uses the anti air fire breath, super jump to the corner, then attack him (Don't attack too much to avoid the super bite), then you need to try to avoid the fireballs again on the same way, if he uses the jump, run away from the corner (Better to turn at his direction while you're doing the super jump to make it easier/faster), or use a slide if the character has.

Basicaly, duck at the right moments, jump at the right moments, don't panic, and abuse things like flight mode and dash in invincible moves (To avoid his shit while you're in the air), and moves which constantly damage him (Yin Yng orbs or Ronald's Fry kids) and pray that he doesn't decide to be an asshole and use the ice fire breath attack while you're crouching, because if that happens, he'll probably use the dash bite, and that means over 50% of your HP is gone lol, also it's good to use the middle platform after you leave the corner, to do the same basic baiting, and delay the him cornering you situations.

Also keep in mind he can't use the same attack twice in a row, so if you escaped the corner when he used the jump, if you're in the air again, he'll probably to the anti air firebreath (He may not use it, sometimes he'll use grounded moves even when you're in the air).

Charlotte fights him on a pretty different way compared to others by the way, she can use Ice needles to destroy fireballs, as a barrier, and her b,d,f+A or C is a good way to leave the corner, use it in combination with her ice needles, she can also use raging fire, but that one is better for raw damage, it's not as safe, so it's better as a round ender.

Edit: Oh yeah, forgot to mention, in case Cerberus uses the fireballs and you're too close to him and, there are 3 options to use in case you have room to get way, characters with Slide can just use the slide, characters with Shield can use use the shield while crouching, get up, then backdash, and characters without either of those can use a crouching attack, backdash, crouch again, crouch attack, backdash... You can also use backdash, crouch, get up, backdash, characters take 2 frames to get up if I'm not wrong, you can use the backdash during that, but that's a just frame thing, so might not be really reliable.
« Last Edit: August 31, 2015, 02:36:06 PM by Lukmendes »

Offline Undead

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Re: List of viable bosses to do a Perfect/Awesome.
« Reply #26 on: August 31, 2015, 03:17:00 PM »
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Cerberus is the most frustrating boss for me! I can only beat him with luck in Hard+.

His patterns and attacks are extremelly quick like, if I jump to lure him, he jumps aswell. If I run, he dashes into me hitting twice for contact damage.

Edit: Just did a playtest with Alucard against him on Quick Vs. (Nightmare), It seems like the Holy Water, Shield and Flight are the only things that are actually effective against him.

- Wing Smash stops too soon, you end up inside him or right behind him as he mauls your back.
- He won't let you Wolf Charge enough, not even as punish, so you also end up inside him.
- Back Stab makes him step back aswell and punish you when you unphase.
- Dark Inferno a.k.a "punish me" lol

Can it be I suck this much?
« Last Edit: August 31, 2015, 03:26:59 PM by Undead »

Offline Lukmendes

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Re: List of viable bosses to do a Perfect/Awesome.
« Reply #27 on: August 31, 2015, 04:04:15 PM »
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- He won't let you Wolf Charge enough, not even as punish, so you also end up inside him.

You're supposed to use Wolf Charge when you're sure Cerberus is going to use the fireballs, activate it when he starts to use the fireballs, release as soon as he's finished, Cerberus will most likely use the dash bite attack, and you'll be far enough from him to avoid contact damage, in case you weren't able to use the fully charged version, super jump into flight, if he uses then fly forward if he uses the anti air fire breath or the jump, get closer to him in case he uses fireballs.

Now that I think of it, you can also use Wolf Charge to punish him in case he uses the anti air fire breath, if you're fast enough you can get the fuly charged version consistently.

Quote
- Back Stab makes him step back aswell and punish you when you unphase.

Forget that move exists lol, if you want to get away from him quickly, Mist form/f,f+C is the way to go, really helpful when he uses the jump and you're cornered.
« Last Edit: August 31, 2015, 04:09:52 PM by Lukmendes »

Offline Anonymous

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Re: List of viable bosses to do a Perfect/Awesome.
« Reply #28 on: September 01, 2015, 10:38:50 AM »
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For LD, I'm thinking that more whip-users can fit in the list (not all though)

(Serious) Jonathan can use axes and his great sword to destroy the skulls fast enough and can use his rocket slash to get to the other side (not fully charged though, but LD is thin enough that you're just unlucky if you get hit in my opinion). (Like Richter and Julius use whip-spin if some still remain).

Nathan Graves' shoulder tackle can help to get him out of corners and he has whip-spin and axes as well.

For others I'm kind of doubting it whether they can or not. Juste no longer has the axe, but he has his ice fist as an escape method and maybe use sacred fist to destroy the skulls, but he has to jump. Sonia and Simon can use whip-spin as a safety measure if the axe doesn't destroy all, but they sadly have no way to get to the other side besides sliding under LD in time. What do you think about Master Skeleton and Reimu (Not exactly the same whip but whatever)?

That's just as far as I tested though, I might just be lucky that it succeeded with those.


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Offline Lukmendes

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Re: List of viable bosses to do a Perfect/Awesome.
« Reply #29 on: September 01, 2015, 02:30:10 PM »
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For LD, I'm thinking that more whip-users can fit in the list (not all though)

(Serious) Jonathan can use axes and his great sword to destroy the skulls fast enough and can use his rocket slash to get to the other side (not fully charged though, but LD is thin enough that you're just unlucky if you get hit in my opinion). (Like Richter and Julius use whip-spin if some still remain).

Nathan Graves' shoulder tackle can help to get him out of corners and he has whip-spin and axes as well.

For others I'm kind of doubting it whether they can or not. Juste no longer has the axe, but he has his ice fist as an escape method and maybe use sacred fist to destroy the skulls, but he has to jump. Sonia and Simon can use whip-spin as a safety measure if the axe doesn't destroy all, but they sadly have no way to get to the other side besides sliding under LD in time. What do you think about Master Skeleton and Reimu (Not exactly the same whip but whatever)?

That's just as far as I tested though, I might just be lucky that it succeeded with those.

I had forgotten the LD section was incomplete lol.

Anyway, Juste probably can do it, up,qcf+A means he can leave the corner, (Though the recovery frames can be a problem), and he can destroy the flying skulls just fine with either the whip or sacred fist (specialy at big distances with sacred fist), Nathan probably can as well.

Now, Jonathan and Master Skeleton? I have my doubts, they have the same basic way to avoid him at the corner, which is with the chargeable dash in move, the problem is that they can't use it in the air, they can activate it in the air, but not use in there, that's actualy why Charlotte is in that list, while she'll be doomed and will have to count on luck to be able to escape if Lesser Demon get too close when she's cornered, she can avoid this situation with her b,d,f by using it in the air, Jonathan and Master Skeleton, best situation I could find was after destroying the flying skulls with their whip, then start to charge b,d,f immediately, and release it once he lands, you'll probably charge it enough to be far from him, only other situation where they can theoricaly use that move is after Lesser Demon uses the venom spit attack, charge it after you jump over it, use it as soon as Lesser Demon starts another attack, if this works, then you'll need to avoid letting him get too close, otherwise this won't work since he'll probably use the punch, and if the character doesn't charge the move enough, Lesser Demon maybe be able to hit the character if he uses a venom spit backwards jump.

Sonia/Simon/Reimu, I doubt it, no invincible dash-in moves means they don't have a reliable way to escape the corner, theoricaly they can avoid his possibilities after a double projectile, by using a slide avoids a forward jump, venom spit, flying skulls summon... Problem is that Lesser Demon has that backwards jump venom spit attack, which is probably made specificaly to counter the slide characters, and while it's totaly possible that Lesser Demon won't use it during the round, that's just counting on luck.